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Noragen Neirfallas
Dedicated and Dangerous The Marmite Collective
1186
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Posted - 2015.07.07 00:27:02 -
[1] - Quote
Petre en Thielles wrote: Sorry, was the character one day old, or the wardec one day old? Because no one should be popping one day old true newbies, wardec or not.
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Noragen Neirfallas
Dedicated and Dangerous The Marmite Collective
1189
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Posted - 2015.07.07 01:30:40 -
[2] - Quote
Petre en Thielles wrote:Yourmoney Mywallet wrote: a) pop all the things. always.
b) if he's really a trunoob, pop him first then take the time to explain to him what happened. also tell him that his ceo will make up for his loss, because - well, that's what a corp is for, no?
c) but yeah - pop all the things.
dude, you do realize f*cking with actual newbies is not allowed by CCP, right? we can't complain about not getting enough players and then pop one day old toons who don't understand the game yet. Gank, by all means, but don't be an a**hole about it to true newbies. If CCP finds out you are doing that, bad things will happen. No
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Noragen Neirfallas
Dedicated and Dangerous The Marmite Collective
1189
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Posted - 2015.07.07 01:53:14 -
[3] - Quote
Allow me to elaborate
Quote:dude, you do realize f*cking with actual newbies is not allowed by CCP, right? we can't complain about not getting enough players and then pop one day old toons who don't understand the game yet. ******* with newbies is not only allowed its actively encouraged in this game in all areas except a specific set of new bro systems ( to allow them to get a basic grasp of mechanics) Personally I pop newbros all the time and unless they decide to be dicks about it generally they get a replaced ship and a suggestion of corps to join (if they are in some terrible one that doesn't help newbros)
Quote:If you're specifically targeting newbies, you need to take a step back and have your head examined. CCP has proof that killing newbros is infact good for retention. One would assume those who take their time to help these new players get into eve should be given praise not implied they are unstable.
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Noragen Neirfallas
Dedicated and Dangerous The Marmite Collective
1191
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Posted - 2015.07.07 02:26:01 -
[4] - Quote
Petre en Thielles wrote: I wasn't responding to you. Did the guy I was talking to offer replacement ships? Not at all. Was just popping a day old toon for sh*ts and giggles. That's completely different than what you are talking about.
Marlin Spikes wrote:We had to take the time out of our busy lives to teach this guy how to get out of system. Yes, we could have let him go, but what would that have taught him? I'll just leave that here
Petre en Thielles wrote: Stay away from anyone not even though the career missions and the SOE arc. After that, I agree with you 100%. People not through the career missions don't even know how to warp to a gate. They get popped, that's being a ****. Popping the month old guy and then giving him a ship I completely support
If they are competent enough to join a corp they are competent enough to get shot at. Bare in mind this happened in A a pipe and B under wardec Failing this B trumps newbro status. You can take my word for that as proving it is a forum rule violation
Petre en Thielles wrote:Noragen Neirfallas wrote: CCP has proof that killing newbros is infact good for retention
Care to give any proof for that? It doesn't surprise me that you pop newbies. Easy, mindless kills wiithout a fight is what HS mercs live for, isn't it? Of course I can. I would be you if I couldn't spitting out nonsense. Link Enjoy
No we live for the tears that people like you generate in our local chats, mail boxes and forum sections 
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Noragen Neirfallas
Dedicated and Dangerous The Marmite Collective
1192
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Posted - 2015.07.07 02:43:26 -
[5] - Quote
Jonah Gravenstein wrote: Marmite took better care of the newbie than the corp that recruited him did.
Sadly this is a daily occurrence. I often have week old players asking how they can join us because in my 20 min conversation they learned more then the 3 days they had been in xyz corp. I politely direct them to eve uni normally but it makes me sad all these 5% corp tax corps recruiting en masse for their own gains. Surely a CCP study needs to be done on player retention of this kind of activity.
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Noragen Neirfallas
Dedicated and Dangerous The Marmite Collective
1207
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Posted - 2015.07.07 03:33:37 -
[6] - Quote
I'm not quoting all that allow me to just retort here briefly instead
1. Marlin did in fact help the newbro out and taught a valuable lesson in warping gate to gate via convo in case you need it all spelt out. 2. It was a noob ship... The lesson learnt could have been in a domi in 3 weeks time if we didn't do it now. This is one more reason shooting them while new is important 3. I was killed in my first month of playing (not my first month after making the account I wasn't wrapped enough with the game in my first week to pay but got convinced later) 4. I was invited to about a dozen corps in local and 2 via mail/convo. I ignored them all as joining some random group for no reason seemed pointless until somebody suggested apping to eve uni which I looked up and it seemed decent with little tax) 6. TLDR on video is that killing newbros is good for retention 7. I do hang out in rookie chat 8. At one month I was ready to quit eve it was only then that I was killed by a wardeccer in my then itty 2 carrying all that I owned -3 ships and thus swore bloody revenge on wardeccers (which I achieved). It got me involved in the game in a way that missions and training skills never could have.
In summary killing new players and helping them out after is Good for the game
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Noragen Neirfallas
Dedicated and Dangerous The Marmite Collective
1230
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Posted - 2015.07.08 23:13:56 -
[7] - Quote
Anybody who checks every character before they kill them is already to risk adverse for my liking
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Noragen Neirfallas
Dedicated and Dangerous The Marmite Collective
1241
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Posted - 2015.07.09 08:25:18 -
[8] - Quote
Mobadder Thworst wrote:Petre en Thielles wrote:[
I understand what you are saying, and obviously we are never going to agree on this.
I as a rule don't do anything to a newbie under a week old, no matter what. I feel they deserve that time to get used to the game. After that, I shoot any chance I get.
Obviously not everyone agrees.
I also never shoot anything that can't shoot back. I don't see the fun of being the guy kicking over the 4 year old's sand castle.
Obviously not everyone agrees with that as well.
In EVE you are allowed (and encouraged) to be the as*hole. That's part of what makes this game work so well. I love EVE as it stands, and without gankers, people hunting newbies, carebear wardec corps shooting people who they know can't fight back, etc. there wouldn't be any 'villains' to fight against. EVE would be a lot less fun.
Personally, I just don't see the draw of hunting a newbie who you know can't do anything to defend themself. But to each his own. Play EVE how you want to play it. That's the idea. CCP did a study a while back and found that newbros who lose ships in non-consentual combat within their first 2 weeks (gank/flip/whatever) statistically stay longer than those who do not have this experience. Short answer: If you don't see the dark side of eve in the first few weeks, you're more likely to quit. I'm still waiting on my retention award. I suspect I'm responsible for a sizeable portion of the player base. I already linked him this. Its like a brick wall even when the game designers release statistics saying his stance is not only misguided but detrimental to the game he doesn't back down or alter his views
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Noragen Neirfallas
Dedicated and Dangerous The Marmite Collective
1243
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Posted - 2015.07.09 13:57:00 -
[9] - Quote
How does one know they are killing a newbie before the deed is done? Your posting in a thread where a newbie was in a pipe...
Reading is hard, isn't it?
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Noragen Neirfallas
Dedicated and Dangerous The Marmite Collective
1249
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Posted - 2015.07.09 23:26:37 -
[10] - Quote
Ah an ALT. I confess I was too busy laughing at you to check. Ahem
C&P Law 1 Post with your main or gtfo. With no killboard history or knowledge on the subject you are discussing, your position just went from face palm to hahaha. Next time you bring a complaint to our forum on your own or somebody else's thread please back it up with experience and/or subject knowledge. Neither of which you have displayed here
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Noragen Neirfallas
Dedicated and Dangerous The Marmite Collective
1259
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Posted - 2015.07.10 11:34:03 -
[11] - Quote
The sheer power of the content we can provide from this forum is amazing. All these scared ALT posters fearful of what we may do. funny for the most part they are the same people that say dont engage people on a station because of the 10 guardians that will suddenly suddenly and mystically appear.
On an unrelated note Marmite has recently dropped its 10 guardian alt accounts minimum to only 8 while we do a recruitment drive. Get in while you can with less then usual minimum requirements
 
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Noragen Neirfallas
Dedicated and Dangerous The Marmite Collective
1267
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Posted - 2015.07.10 14:48:17 -
[12] - Quote
Let's put things back into perspective for you by quoting your first and second post
Petre en Thielles wrote: dude, you do realize f*cking with actual newbies is not allowed by CCP, right? we can't complain about not getting enough players in the game and poor NPE and then pop one day old toons who don't understand the game yet. Go gank someone who at least knows what an afterburner is, for christ sake.
Gank, by all means, but don't be an a**hole about it to true newbies. If CCP finds out you are doing that, bad things will happen.
And
Petre en Thielles wrote: Sorry, was the character one day old, or the wardec one day old? Because no one should be popping one day old true newbies, wardec or not.
At this point I'd like to make a note that you have argued that new players quit from dying (proven false by CCP) Killing newbies under wardec is punishable (proven false) Claimed PvP experience and/or knowledge (proven false) Claimed tears other then your own exist in this thread (yet you post with an ALT because *insert convenient boogie man* will bully you if you post on a main. We like to call this tears and/or fear)
Did I miss anything?
( Post was made with phone apologies for spelling, format and/or order of quotes)
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Noragen Neirfallas
Dedicated and Dangerous The Marmite Collective
1269
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Posted - 2015.07.10 23:38:50 -
[13] - Quote
Petre en Thielles wrote:dude, you do realize f*cking with actual newbies is not allowed by CCP, right? we can't complain about not getting enough players in the game and poor NPE and then pop one day old toons who don't understand the game yet. Go gank someone who at least knows what an afterburner is, for christ sake.
Gank, by all means, but don't be an a**hole about it to true newbies. If CCP finds out you are doing that, bad things will happen. Underlined to make things simpler
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Noragen Neirfallas
Dedicated and Dangerous The Marmite Collective
1287
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Posted - 2015.07.13 20:59:37 -
[14] - Quote
Petre en Thielles wrote:Kaely Tanniss wrote:You don't PvP much do you..I cba to look up your kb...if you did, you'd know checking a chars age on grid is not only not feasible, but just plain stupid with a hot target on grid. Perhaps you should start a thread asking CCP to make it so noobs can't leave starter systems until the tutorial missions are completed..or for a period of time...with that being said, the "features and Ideas" threads are that way >>>.  Having zkillboard open in the in-game browser and typing in their name takes about one and a half seconds. Do you PvP much? Locking and poping takes the same time. Warping off takes about the same too...
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Noragen Neirfallas
Dedicated and Dangerous The Marmite Collective
1301
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Posted - 2015.07.15 00:39:07 -
[15] - Quote
Just for the record if I discovered a 2 and a half week old player in a domi navy running lvl 4 SOE missions I would kill it with fire for the learning opportunity it would present me with. Also the kill was juicy...
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Noragen Neirfallas
Dedicated and Dangerous The Marmite Collective
1303
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Posted - 2015.07.15 13:05:54 -
[16] - Quote
Count Szadek wrote:Petre en Thielles wrote:Jonah Gravenstein wrote:. Empty quoting because I am not interested in a 17 page conversation. You ignored the quote I gave by GM Homonoia. "Again, spirit of the rule, not the letter. If you find yourself trying to figure out specifically where we draw the line you are obviously targeting rookies, which is NOT allowed. You decide to do this, you will find out where the line is when we warn you." What, exactly do you think the GM meant by that? Focus on "the spirit of the rule, not the letter" That was exactly my point. I do try to help as much as I can, but when a corp recruiter sits in a newbie system sending out convos with corp invites to two hour old players, do we then blame the two hour old player, or the corp recruiter (who is at war) for abusing a newbie? I think if someone can't handle getting ganked, they don't belong in EVE, but for the fourth time, give them a day or two to settle in. Where's the line between teaching a rookie a trial by fire and just being an as*hole? The Ruling is in regards to Rookie Systems and Following From Rookie Systems. They do not get a free ride at being un-shootable while at war. it applies to ganking, theft, tricking, scamming, etc. When they are not in the rookie systems or traveling between, the ruling does not apply. This is what I see as the context. Some guys in bni tried to abuse this in a war scenario and formed a 5 man new player fleet one jump out of a new bro system after a marmite killed one there. They then baited on the gate to the newbro system and promptly jumped in on the marmite/s landing and all tried petitioning it. Thanks to this and other incidents wars overwrite newbro immunity everywhere
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